请教消费性电子产品不具有待机模式，是不是就不适用ErP 1275/2008?

zhd_niuniu

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REGULATION (EC) No 1275/2008是关于家用和办公用电子电气设备 待机和关机模式电能消耗的生态设计要求，但是法规中并没有说设备必须要同时具备待机模式，对吗？只要产品满足该法规的定义并且产品落在ANNEX I的产品清单中就需要符合该法规，是这样吗？请大家帮忙解惑。

Article 1 Subject matter and scope
This Regulation establishes ecodesign requirements related to standby and off mode electric power consumption. This Regulation applies to electrical and electronic household and office equipment.  （我的产品是家用电子设备）
5 w8 o, g2 J: E! l% D! M
! ~: N1 V8 y5 ~% A$ E' T1. ‘electrical and electronic household and office equipment’ (hereafter referred to as ‘equipment’), means any energyusing product which:（满足下面的要求）
(a) is made commercially available as a single functional unit and is intended for the end-user;
/ o. R8 V. V' Y(b) falls under the list of energy-using products of Annex I;
* E4 j1 X, l8 j2 G5 ?(c) is dependent on energy input from the mains power source in order to work as intended; and
(d) is designed for use with a nominal voltage rating of 250 V or below,
also when marketed for non-household or non-office use;2. ‘standby mode(s)’ means a condition where the equipment is connected to the mains power source, depends on energy input from the mains power source to work as intended and provides only the following functions, which may persist for an indefinite time:（不具有关机模式）
— reactivation function, or reactivation function and only an indication of enabled reactivation function, and/or
& X( {4 {0 u* ]) k— information or status display;3. ‘reactivation function’ means a function facilitating the activation of other modes, including active mode, by remote switch, including remote control, internal sensor, timer to a condition providing additional functions, including the main function;
* V0 x8 {8 L. S" hANNEX I List of energy-using products covered by this Regulation
1. Household appliances
Washing machines
Clothes dryers
Dish washing machines
0 m6 ~- U9 C: gCooking:
  l! F# V' W4 L+ |Electric ovens
: b% h* ?- O0 ?. B8 g- q; gElectric hot plates
  _$ I( S# ~$ ?5 ~1 l2 WMicrowave ovens
7 G8 x4 }, Q5 w" w& [" RToasters
% Z, d4 d' y3 y- i( m; Y& gFryers
& @" \# E' ~( {; nGrinders, coffee machines and equipment for opening or sealing containers or packages
: C2 ?) |  n* QElectric knives
Other appliances for cooking and other processing of food, cleaning, and maintenance of clothes
Appliances for hair cutting, hair drying, tooth brushing, shaving, massage and other body care appliances
Scales
# T" G; Z2 G7 M2. Information technology equipment intended primarily for use in the domestic environment
1 i; J2 c3 U# r* L  Q3. Consumer equipment
Radio sets
Television sets
Videocameras
Video recorders
5 ^8 \  d9 X7 t+ pHi-fi recorders
Audio amplifiers
8 h7 _4 U3 x8 B; Z) ]; `) cHome theatre systems
Musical instruments
And other equipment for the purpose of recording or reproducing sound or images, including signals or other
# o+ S+ R, B$ I5 n5 stechnologies for the distribution of sound and image other than by telecommunications (我的产品属于这类设备)
0 R: |  P+ T: D8 ~# x
$ I/ V3 C, J0 s9 d& r/ V9 z

wyq794

先要搞清楚什么是待机模式：
4 z8 r& n& t2 s/ w# i# B& t: W‘standby mode(s)’means a condition where the equipment is connected to the mains power source,depends on energy input from the mains power source to work as intended and providesonly the following functions, which may persist for an indefinite time:
--reactivation function,or reactivation function and only an indication of enabled reactivation function, and/or
--—information or status display;
如果你的产品都没这个功能，那么硬套这个条款肯定不对。

leo2015

现在最新的COMMISSION REGULATION (EU) No 801/2013是对1275/2008的修订，可参考801/2013找到答案。针对您的问题，分享下我的观点哈
如果你的产品属于附录I 3大类里面的其它，而且不是网络为主功能的设备，那么依据801/2013 ‘(d) Power management for all equipment other than networked equipment
/ V0 P" V4 }" b7 ^& i/ C) fEquipment shall, unless inappropriate for the intended use, offer a power management function or a similar function. When equipment is not providing the main function, and other energy- using product(s) are not dependent on its functions, the power management function shall switch equipment after the shortest possible period of time appropriate for the intended use of the equipment, automatically into:
1 P4 r7 [& [1 c+ q— standby mode, or
— off mode, or
1 y0 U' E' a" S, A, W% K# z- ^9 E0 P— another condition which does not exceed the applicable power consumption requirements for off mode and/or standby mode when the equipment is connected to the mains power source.
3 g* H9 X* |- V6 M  [2 `The power management function shall be activated.
所以要求产品具有电源管理功能使得产品能进入以下三种中任一个即可：
待机/关机/或者另外一种管理模式下的能耗不能超过关机和待机的能耗。

leo2015

除非产品不适合预期使用，不能设计出来这个待机或者关机模式，这个得需要提供合理的理由；我是这样理解的，但好多3rd机构都要求产品具有待机或者关机的电源管理功能。因人而异吧。

zhd_niuniu

leo2015 发表于 2015-8-27 14:26
9 M: f9 D- Q: s/ J1 R+ R9 L除非产品不适合预期使用，不能设计出来这个待机或者关机模式，这个得需要提供合理的理由；我是这样理解的， ...

谢谢你的耐心解答。如果真是这种情况“除非产品不适合预期使用，不能设计出来这个待机或者关机模式”，制造商可以给出适当的理由，产品可以不具有电源管理功能。要不然产品就必需具有电源管理功能，产品需要可以进入下面三个中的任一模式，
+ e! L2 s; K' N3 d9 F# W: t" R— standby mode, or
— off mode, or
— another condition which does not exceed the applicable power consumption requirements for off mode and/or standby mode when the equipment is connected to the mains power source.
) |" Z" x0 ^& D6 N8 B- t8 l# _) y
; ?0 @  i) z% R6 B* P- s% J并且满足下面的能耗要求。我这样理解对吗？
2 B& e4 D4 [: _2. Four years after this Regulation has come into force:
(a) Power consumption in ‘off mode’:
     Power consumption of equipment in any off-mode condition shall not exceed 0,50 W.
4 a3 k$ d$ n* j& D$ \, K(b) Power consumption in ‘standby mode(s)’:
2 E3 V2 D; P+ n; ^     The power consumption of equipment in any condition providing only a reactivation function, or providing only a reactivation function and a mere indication of enabled reactivation function, shall not exceed 0,50 W.
     The power consumption of equipment in any condition providing only information or status display, or providing only a combination of reactivation function and information or status display shall not exceed 1,00 W.

leo2015

zhd_niuniu 发表于 2015-8-27 15:48
谢谢你的耐心解答。如果真是这种情况“除非产品不适合预期使用，不能设计出来这个待机或者关机模式”，制 ...

是的，我也是这么理解的

zhd_niuniu

leo2015 发表于 2015-8-27 14:26
3 [' i+ v) @5 S1 a" ~除非产品不适合预期使用，不能设计出来这个待机或者关机模式，这个得需要提供合理的理由；我是这样理解的， ...

0 `4 N+ K" `( Q) m! K  B8 [4 m可以帮忙具体看看这样一款产品吗？产品网址链接如下，产品图片下面对应可以看到产品规格信息和下载到使用说明书。
' M/ l) H: ^3 L9 l" f$ hhttps://www.akai.nl/nl/component ... 37824934.html#specs
我的供应商有给到我们LVD和EMC的测试报告，但是没有ErP的。他们的理由是：产品不具有待机模式，并且是“professional equipment” ，因此不在1275/2008管控附录产品清单范围。
$ _0 P3 ^) E& T5 s  h
我的理解是，上述产品是作为家庭娱乐设备使用，另根据EMC协调标准EN 55103中对"professional apparatus"的定义，显然排除这个产品是专业设备。产品虽然不具有待机模式但是有关机模式，产品是在1275/2008附录I中第3点Consumer equipment下面的最后一类。请帮忙看看具体产品分析下我的理解对吗？
G.2.1 Meaning and implications of 'professional'
The definition of 'professional apparatus' included in EN 61000-3-2 has been adopted. It has proved difficult
+ D( e+ ~7 B. \( U0 yto develop a definition which is generally acceptable, particularly now that products intended for consumer
# m/ B9 X( T* y5 m3 ]entertainment applications are also used in what are clearly recognisable as professional applications, such
" T) e* p/ H: e( |as electronic news-gathering. Professional apparatus is generally characterized by
+ v6 v6 D1 n! Z% @-  manufacture in small quantities (1 to 1 000 a year),
2 J( T8 }6 S$ }% {, e4 K# A-  a high level of technical performance, carefully oriented to the application,
-  installation and maintenance by technically-trained persons,
-  not normally used in the family home.
It would not be correct to assume that
-  professional apparatus cannot be (or should not be allowed to be) purchased by any person who
has the necessary financial resources,
-  professional apparatus is used exclusively or even mainly by 'professionals' in the sense of
'persons trained and skilled in electrical or electronic technology'. For example, electronic newsgathering
equipment is used by journalists, not audio or video engineers,
0 [9 {: }2 d$ M% H& F6 e# L/ Y-  the above-mentioned 'high level of technical performance' applies to any arbitrarily chosen
" d8 c5 Y$ X0 M( }, \" Zcharacteristic. For example, the frequency response of an intercom system may be very
restricted, because this is necessary in order that the overall performance of the system meets
& |9 x+ N0 [) ]% g2 p6 Ethe necessary operational requirements.

热爱学习

我觉得你没有必要纠结这些模糊不清的定义，电源管理系统有可能是软件控制比如电脑，也有可能是个开关，比如电视机开关，这个指令的出发点就是用电的产品在连接电源而又不在预计使用的工作状态下功耗必须低至一定范围内，主要是处于节能的考量，而且标准中说的是待机跟关机都要符合要求，而不是说设备必须同时有待机和关机功能
: X' }; i2 ^% @# O1 }' r- [" [9 k只要设备与电源保持连通而又没进行正常进行的工作时就必须满足要求，除非产品没有开关，插上电源就一直工作，除非拔掉电源才停止，或者一些预定连续不间歇工作的设备，比如电梯
) s& z2 v1 L8 g6 k3 ?

zhd_niuniu

热爱学习 发表于 2015-8-27 16:36
我觉得你没有必要纠结这些模糊不清的定义，电源管理系统有可能是软件控制比如电脑，也有可能是个开关，比如 ...

$ s7 X  M5 p- H0 k0 ]# Q: M8 I; q谢谢你的解释，主要是我对标准内容理解很模糊。大家的解释已经清晰多了，感谢。

kurtliang

Good to know it.